I'm afraid I can't really answer this one, since I generally feel it's okay to respond to violence with violence. I suppose seeking help from an authority (a casual one or an official one, depending on what kind of situation said violence is occurring in*) would be the only real answer I could come up with. Are we talking about ways to deal with it happening, though, or ways to make it stop?
For this is a gracious thing, when, mindful of God, one endures sorrows while suffering unjustly. For what credit is it if, when you sin and are beaten for it, you endure? But if when you do good and suffer for it you endure, this is a gracious thing in the sight of God. For to this you have been called, because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, so that you might follow in his steps. He committed no sin, neither was deceit found in his mouth. When he was reviled, he did not revile in return; when he suffered, he did not threaten, but continued entrusting himself to him who judges justly.
mind you at heart i'm pretty much a passivifist(sp?). responding to violence with violence seems like fighting fire with fire which just creates more fire.
however, there are situations and degrees of violence i feel are appropriate at times. like if my government had gone into afghanistan and covertly gotten al queda, even if some violence was done, i would've been ok with that. bombing a third world country back to the stone age was excessive and reeked fo vegence not justice which is the creating more fire thing.
self defense is also a time where i believe reacting to violence with violence is acceptable. to the point where you actually just defending yourself.
it's a tough question. the best one can really do is live the way you feel is right and remember that each situation is differnt and involves choice. what do you choose to do?
Foof. I have no idea. I guess perhaps that violence can be overcome with stubborn, passive, resistence. "Get up and Fight!".... "No" would be the only answer I could evince. But I simply would be lying if I didn't feel that hostage takers and beheaders in Iraq should suffer similar fates before *their* families' eyes.
No, Karen, your verse entirely spoke to the point whether dealing with persecution or violence on the whole. In fact, your line of thinking was running closest to mine own, and your point of view is similarly close. So thank you. My question is still how? How do you find a way to do that? Especially when acting in a loving way to others means acting in an unloving way towards one's self.
Jess: I have to agree with you. Personally, I am also a pacifist and, though I can see how some violence could be considered appropriate, my biggest problem is that I probably wouldn't use physical violence against someone in self defence. That goes out the window if it's in order to protect someone else but that's the only time I can think of that I would be tempted to violence and, thank the Lord, it has never come up. In the end, my approach to immediate physical violence is that of Fenris: passivity. There are probably exceptions, of course, but this is my experience.
But I suppose my definition of violence was somewhat more... loose.
Fox: in the end, both. I think I've been unclear, though. I was thinking more about repeating cycles (like Jess's fire with fire); like domestic violence and the instances of people who have been abused later becoming the abuser. And instances of self-abuse in the same. So, I suppose it's about how an individual responds to past violence without becoming violent themselves. Is that more clear? Sorry, my head's even fuzzier than normal. It's been a bad week.
I know what you mean but I was thinking more in terms of the after effects of having violence perpetrated against one, and how to avoid taking said violence to heart and becoming violent against others or oneself. How does aikido principles help with that?
8 comments:
I'm afraid I can't really answer this one, since I generally feel it's okay to respond to violence with violence. I suppose seeking help from an authority (a casual one or an official one, depending on what kind of situation said violence is occurring in*) would be the only real answer I could come up with. Are we talking about ways to deal with it happening, though, or ways to make it stop?
*Yes Talen, I know that was bad grammar. STFU!
1 Peter 2:11-25—particularly
For this is a gracious thing, when, mindful of God, one endures sorrows while suffering unjustly. For what credit is it if, when you sin and are beaten for it, you endure? But if when you do good and suffer for it you endure, this is a gracious thing in the sight of God. For to this you have been called, because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, so that you might follow in his steps. He committed no sin, neither was deceit found in his mouth. When he was reviled, he did not revile in return; when he suffered, he did not threaten, but continued entrusting himself to him who judges justly.
mind you at heart i'm pretty much a passivifist(sp?). responding to violence with violence seems like fighting fire with fire which just creates more fire.
however, there are situations and degrees of violence i feel are appropriate at times. like if my government had gone into afghanistan and covertly gotten al queda, even if some violence was done, i would've been ok with that. bombing a third world country back to the stone age was excessive and reeked fo vegence not justice which is the creating more fire thing.
self defense is also a time where i believe reacting to violence with violence is acceptable. to the point where you actually just defending yourself.
it's a tough question. the best one can really do is live the way you feel is right and remember that each situation is differnt and involves choice. what do you choose to do?
Hmm, sorry, I proferred that Bible verse while only thinking in the context of persecution.
Foof. I have no idea. I guess perhaps that violence can be overcome with stubborn, passive, resistence. "Get up and Fight!".... "No" would be the only answer I could evince. But I simply would be lying if I didn't feel that hostage takers and beheaders in Iraq should suffer similar fates before *their* families' eyes.
No, Karen, your verse entirely spoke to the point whether dealing with persecution or violence on the whole. In fact, your line of thinking was running closest to mine own, and your point of view is similarly close. So thank you. My question is still how? How do you find a way to do that? Especially when acting in a loving way to others means acting in an unloving way towards one's self.
Jess: I have to agree with you. Personally, I am also a pacifist and, though I can see how some violence could be considered appropriate, my biggest problem is that I probably wouldn't use physical violence against someone in self defence. That goes out the window if it's in order to protect someone else but that's the only time I can think of that I would be tempted to violence and, thank the Lord, it has never come up. In the end, my approach to immediate physical violence is that of Fenris: passivity. There are probably exceptions, of course, but this is my experience.
But I suppose my definition of violence was somewhat more... loose.
Fox: in the end, both. I think I've been unclear, though. I was thinking more about repeating cycles (like Jess's fire with fire); like domestic violence and the instances of people who have been abused later becoming the abuser. And instances of self-abuse in the same. So, I suppose it's about how an individual responds to past violence without becoming violent themselves. Is that more clear? Sorry, my head's even fuzzier than normal. It's been a bad week.
Just to further clarify: my definition of 'violence' included mental and emotional abuse.
I know what you mean but I was thinking more in terms of the after effects of having violence perpetrated against one, and how to avoid taking said violence to heart and becoming violent against others or oneself. How does aikido principles help with that?
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